Progressive weakness in 12y.o German Shepherd

[jlandry78]

My dog, Faith (12 y.o. female German Shepherd) has had progressive weakness in her limbs starting about 1 ½ years ago. It began in her hind legs and within the last several months has also affected her trunk and front legs. She has been using a wheeled cart to walk for over a year. We’ve had x-rays done last year, which showed some calcification and bridging mainly in the lumbar spine, but some in the cervical spine as well. Spondylosis was also noted. But other than that have never gotten a diagnosis as to what may be causing the weakness. Most vets have taken the approach that getting an official diagnosis may not necessarily change the treatment we are doing (which has been mainly complementary and alternative medicine treatments such as laser, massage, acupuncture, acupressure, strengthening exercises, stretching, CBD, and addressing diet and supplements). While that was also my perspective for a while (that a diagnosis wouldn't really be beneficial), I"m starting to question that and wonder if I would have been able to do something else other than just manage the symptoms with a more accurate diagnosis. From my own research I know what the possibilities are and most point to degerative myelopathy, although there are other possibities. Her vet has given the option of getting a blood or saliva test to confirm that diagnosis, but from what I have learned about the test is while it can used helpful in the diagnosis process, it is not always accurate or conclusive.

Has anyone gotten a DM test for their dog (or for the veterinarians in this group, what are your thoughts on this test)? Was having that diagnosis helpful? What would be best way for me to decide if getting this is the best route to go?

Can anyone recommend a holistically minded veterinary neurologist? I’ve considered doing this also, but I know many times what is recommended is doing an MRI to get amore accurate diagnosis and I’m not sure she is in a condition where sedation for that would be safe. I’m wondering if it would be beneficial to talk to someone anyway? Or if it’s even too late at this point to do anything because the weakness has progressed to the point it has. We live on the Central Coast of California (about 1 hour North of Santa Barbara)

I'd love to be able to support her in the best way possible, I'm just not sure what that is right now. I've attached a few pictures of her.

Jill

 

[Dr. Jeff]

What a sweet and beautiful face she has!

Thanks for sharing these pics of Faith.

How long did it take her to start using the wheelchair?

Did Faith have any other health challenges when she was younger?

If so, how were they treated and what happened after the treatment?

This is important to know for two reasons.

1. It gives us information about her vitality

2. Symptom suppression can trigger the NWS (never well since) syndrome and dis-eases that are best treated by knowing that they came from suppression.

BTW-For students studying homeopathy, here's a helpful rubric to use for symptom suppression:

GENERALS - DISCHARGES - amel.: (61)

(Quiz for them: why would we use this rubric?)

Regarding the x-rays, yes, bridging spondylosis can be a clue to vertebral instability and inflammation and cauda equina syndrome that can manifest with DM symptoms.

Regarding whether to proceed with further diagnostics, well that depends on whether you will feel better at ease with them.

Personally, I would.

As an example, I was diagnosed with a "mystery" neurologic dis-ease at the age of 12 and symptoms have continued throughout my life.

They'd engendered the "anxiety of uncertainty" in me until I received my "definitive" diagnosis several years ago.

I mention this because relieving our own distress is one of the good reasons to get a diagnosis.

Assuming that it can be reached using non-invasive diagnostics like a blood, saliva or urine test (and x-rays, ultrasound, etc.).

Anesthesia for MRI and is invasive. Especially if IV contrast and spinal taps are done at the same time (as they often are).

I would do the DM tests for genetic markers (there's more than one).

However, the results probably will not affect how you treat Faith.

The deciding factor might be expense. If that's not a factor, then get the test.

If expense (cost depends on the testing lab) is an issue, then do not even bother.

Assume she has DM and treat her as you have been (+ Hahnemannian homeopathy).

Regardless of how you treat and your diagnostic decision, try adding raw chicken and beef heart to her diet.

I can't think of a NoCal holistically-oriented vet neuro offhand but maybe @Dr. Christina does.

Please keep us updated in this thread about Faith's treatment and how she is doing.

 

[Dr. Christina]

Faith is so blessed to have you, Jill, knowing so much, researching other options and taking the loads of time to enjoy every possible moment with her as you treat her. I know it is very time consuming.

I lean towards not doing the tests as the best treatment for DM is what you are already doing and classical homeopathy. Since you have been doing acupuncture and it is helping manage symptoms, I would suggest, as Dr. Jeff did, to begin working with a classical homeopath to see if you can achieve better results. As a member you can work with Dr. Jeff. Also, Dr. Diana Bochenski is in Buellton, CA.

I do not know of a holistic neurologist. As you said, neurologists in general are more likely to focus on testing to get an answer rather than knowing homeopathy.

Dr. Christina

 

[jlandry78]

What a sweet and beautiful face she has!

Thanks for sharing these pics of Faith.

How long did it take her to start using the wheelchair?

Did Faith have any other health challenges when she was younger?

If so, how were they treated and what happened after the treatment?

This is important to know for two reasons.

1. It gives us information about her vitality

2. Symptom suppression can trigger the NWS (never well since) syndrome and dis-eases that are best treated by knowing that they came from suppression.

BTW-For students studying homeopathy, here's a helpful rubric to use for symptom suppression:



(Quiz for them: why would we use this rubric?)

Regarding the x-rays, yes, bridging spondylosis can be a clue to vertebral instability and inflammation and cauda equina syndrome that can manifest with DM symptoms.

Regarding whether to proceed with further diagnostics, well that depends on whether you will feel better at ease with them.

Personally, I would.

As an example, I was diagnosed with a "mystery" neurologic dis-ease at the age of 12 and symptoms have continued throughout my life.

They'd engendered the "anxiety of uncertainty" in me until I received my "definitive" diagnosis several years ago.

I mention this because relieving our own distress is one of the good reasons to get a diagnosis.

Assuming that it can be reached using non-invasive diagnostics like a blood, saliva or urine test (and x-rays, ultrasound, etc.).

Anesthesia for MRI and is invasive. Especially if IV contrast and spinal taps are done at the same time (as they often are).

I would do the DM tests for genetic markers (there's more than one).

However, the results probably will not affect how you treat Faith.

The deciding factor might be expense. If that's not a factor, then get the test.

If expense (cost depends on the testing lab) is an issue, then do not even bother.

Assume she has DM and treat her as you have been (+ Hahnemannian homeopathy).

Regardless of how you treat and your diagnostic decision, try adding raw chicken and beef heart to her diet.

I can't think of a NoCal holistically-oriented vet neuro offhand but maybe @Dr. Christina does.

Please keep us updated in this thread about Faith's treatment and how she is doing.

Hello Dr. Jeff

 

[jlandry78]

Hello Dr. Jeff,

Thank you for your reply.
To answer your questions -

Did Faith have any other health challenges when she was younger? If so, how were they treated and what happened after the treatment?
I only know based on what I have in her medical records (I adopted her when she was 9). She had a fracture in her L rear foot when she was just a few months old. It didn't heal well and required surgical stabilization as well as a immobilization for quite some time. It seemed like it was a prolonged healing process and she was on antibiotics quite a bit for post surgical infections in her foot as well as other reasons. I know also from the records that she had Parvo at one point.

I do hear what you are saying about getting a diagnosis. I think it might help to calm my wondering mind. It's not a very expensive test and it involves a sample or saliva or blood, so I there isn't much risk to it. I think my biggest question was whether the test was accurate enough to really be able to trust the results. Have you heard much about that?

You said treat using Hahnemannian homeopathy. Can you give me an example of what that would look like?

 

[jlandry78]

Faith is so blessed to have you, Jill, knowing so much, researching other options and taking the loads of time to enjoy every possible moment with her as you treat her. I know it is very time consuming.

I lean towards not doing the tests as the best treatment for DM is what you are already doing and classical homeopathy. Since you have been doing acupuncture and it is helping manage symptoms, I would suggest, as Dr. Jeff did, to begin working with a classical homeopath to see if you can achieve better results. As a member you can work with Dr. Jeff. Also, Dr. Diana Bochenski is in Buellton, CA.

I do not know of a holistic neurologist. As you said, neurologists in general are more likely to focus on testing to get an answer rather than knowing homeopathy.

Dr. Christina

 

[jlandry78]

Dr. Chritina, Thank you for your reply and for saying that Faith is blessed to have me. I am blessed to have her too! We did work with a homeopathic vet for a while. Shortly after starting the homeopathic treatment Faith got a UTI that continued for months. It got to the point where there was blood in her urine all the time and the homeopathy despite changing remedies did not seem to clear it. I felt I needed to go with a more conventional route at that time and we weren't able to continue the homeopathy. Do you feel that sometimes it takes working with a few different practitioners before finding the right fit?

How could homeopathy possibly help relive the symptoms of DM? (if that is indeed what it is)?

Jill

 

[Dr. Jeff]

Great questions Jill!

1. Yes! Because homeopathy is an art as well as a medical science, sometimes a new point of view and a different "artist" is useful.

It also can help to look closely at the background, training and experience of the homeopathic practitioner. This of course is true for any vet or MD with whom you consult.

2. Regardless of diagnosis, homeopathy can help the body heal. The only limits to homeopathic treatment are the amount which the body is able to heal.

From what research has shown us over the past 10-20 years, healing by the body is almost limitless.

Doctors really don't know how much healing is possible.

The saying "where there's life, there's hope" (and Faith) is 100% true.

Quantum Healing: Exploring the Frontiers of Mind/Body Medicine: Chopra, Deepak: 9780553053685: Amazon.com: Books

Quantum Healing: Exploring the Frontiers of Mind/Body Medicine [Chopra, Deepak] on Amazon.com. *FREE* shipping on qualifying offers. Quantum Healing: Exploring the Frontiers of Mind/Body Medicine

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For example, just 10 years ago conventional medicine was sure that the brain couldn't regenerate, rewire and heal.

We now know that the brain does indeed heal.

However, if healing is truly unlikely, e.g. when a vital gland or organ is 99% destroyed and scarred, then homeopathy can only stimulate partial healing (whats is called palliation in homeopathy).

However even in these dire situations, homeopathic stimulation of the healing mechanisms is often still more effective than drugs.

 

[LilF]

Is there a homeopathic remedy for hind end weakness? This old post addresses a current problem I am having. I too wonder if JJ's remedy prescribed is connected to now hind end weakness (he has an ACL tear but it was not causing weakness) The vet said his hips and knees actually have little arthritis so why is he more lame now after his xrays 2 days ago and starting the remedies 4 days ago for his heart and kidney. It is hard and expensive to "homeopath shop around" and I am not sure the time it takes to set it up will be "in time" to help JJ who is already 15. How long does a remedy take to see improvement or decline to make a decision as to whether it needs to be adjusted?

 

[Dr. Christina]

Ahh... Lil...I bet you know the answer I will give.
IT DEPENDS
Yes, we have all treated dogs with DM or other weaknesses successfully - maybe not a cure, but at least moving towards a cure with good BEAM.

All illness begins as an energy imbalance - "I jusst know he is not well. NO symptoms, but I just sense it"
Then 'functional' - "dog itches but no skin lesions". If not successfully treated at that time, the ONE DISEASE/ONE VITAL FORCE IMBALANCE progresses to Inflammation - fever, swelling, pain, loss of function. Itchy dog now has raw spots, red skin, etc. Finally, if not successfully rebalanced, we have tissue pathology. It is not the years that cause our problems, it is not being balanced, in spite of our best attempts.

It sounds like he has pathology - heart damage and kidney damage. Or it may still be in the inflammatory stage.The lameness sounds like still in the functional stage. with pathology, it takes much longer to respond. the BEAM should respond in a few days to weeks if right treatments.

When you say started remedies - which veterinary homeopath are you working with?

Yes, it can be challenging to create your team when they are already ill.
the Health BAsics 101 course, lesson 5, talks about how to do that.
Dr. Christina

 

[LilF]

Dr. Christina, yes I see the progression to overt disease you describe in all my past dogs....interesting. JJ started to wet the bed at night the day after his acupuncture last week where the vet "opened the channels" versus just treating his ACL injury. (I always heard acupuncture was great for incontinence) His appetite decreased more as well. I know, we don't know how each thing is working if we do too many things at once. He is supposed to go in for another acupuncture this week but I am going to insist she just treat his injury with acupuncture. He had not wet the bed for a few weeks prior to this and was "holding" it for 12 hours at night.

I saw on the holistic dog summit, Dr. Basko (not sure of the exact name or spelling) who describes dogs he treated with six needles in the back end that were paralyzed and 80 percent were successfully walking afterwards.

I am working with Dr. Loops who said that he thought acupuncture was a good idea. He gave me remedies for the ligament, appetite (which isn't helping much), kidney and heart. JJ just lays around all day and not sure how much walking he should do with his partial ligament tear. He doesn't really desire to walk. After being on his feet, he just wants to sit or lay down again.
I have never had magical results from acupuncture and if anything, worse results or a speeding up of the decline for some reason.
I don't know if he is too old for rehab at 15. Thanks for the information and enjoyed your interview on the Pet Summit!
Is there a remedy to strengthen the hind end I should ask for?

 

[GinnyW]

And MY guessable answer to Lil is that homeopathy is not chosen by, nor does it work upon, a "this for that" function. Every remedy is selected according to its total symptom picture and the match between that picture and the total presentation of the patient. This includes everything about the prominent symptom, but also everything else about the subject: past afflictions, habits, diet, likes, dislikes, etc. There is no such thing as a remedy FOR a back leg. But there may well be remedies which match the patient's total presentation, and one or another of these MIGHT have a record of improving a joint deficiency. Got it? No "this for that" in classical practice. So, don't judge your practitioner's choices on that basis.

Homeopathic first aid is, however, much more closely associated with acute, immediate, injuries, and we can prescribe it in much more of a "this for that" manner. This is for accidents, sudden illness, life-threatening events - stuff where the body is in immediate need of help. You gave him Arnica appropriately. Now he needs a slower, deeper remedy, which your homeopath likely prescribed.

Don't worry about his incontinence. Nerves in that area can get overstimulated easily when other stuff is going on. I think it's probably a good sign And, as far as "just treating his injury", acupuncture is a bit like homeopathy in that points far away from perceived injury or insult are often just the ones we need to tickle So, once again, you cannot say "this for that, please". Let her choose what will work best for him. This is energy medicine, too, and will affect his whole body.

 

[LilF]

Oh Ginny, you are such a dear!! I am so much an "information calms me" kinda gal and you really nailed that ---it is "my homeopathy for the mind". To make decisions, it so helps to understand and have things make sense as like you just elaborated on. We are going this morning and thank doG my internet was working for me to get this message. I do plead ignorance in homeopathy and a slow learner. The first aid version has worked for me and some of my dogs. I think Dr. Loops said I could still give arnica.... When I give it to JJ he is like Lazarus rising from the dead. He seems to get up in short order. I have anxiety about everyday and how he is doing. This injury really took him down a notch from his plateau. Gotta go now, his appointment is soon. Thank you!!

 

[GinnyW]

Sorta maybe a little bit apropos here:...from a medical publication to which I subscribe:

Mindset as Medicine: How the Power of Belief and Hope Can Heal​

By Sarah LoBisco, ND, IFMCP

"Much of my job is supplementing my client’s medical care with a whole-person program that incorporates the mind-body connection. I do not promise results or state untruths or non-scientific claims. I do, however, remind my clients that they are a miracle and that their body responds biochemically to their thoughts. I also invite them to rediscover their innate intelligence of how their body wants them to be well and it uses their symptoms as a form of gentle communication, not a scolding.