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- Dec 30, 2018
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I would suggest that you consider whether you want to have a full spay performed on your girl. You have waited long enough that the joints should be mature, so that is one good thing.
As discussed in the Empower Hour, and in my upcoming course on neutering, there are far more important functions of the reproductive hormones than simply reproduction. The gonadal hormones influence metabolism, nervous system function, urinary tract muscular strength, immune system function and cancer risk, and basic body homeostasis. Removing the gonads is associated with an increased incidence of many chronic diseases.
You have the option of hysterectomy -removing just the uterus and cervix, and leaving the ovaries in the dog. This removes the risk of pyometra and makes your dog sterile. It also eliminate the mess of the heat cycle, though your female will still cycle and be attractive to males.
As discussed in the Empower Hour, and in my upcoming course on neutering, there are far more important functions of the reproductive hormones than simply reproduction. The gonadal hormones influence metabolism, nervous system function, urinary tract muscular strength, immune system function and cancer risk, and basic body homeostasis. Removing the gonads is associated with an increased incidence of many chronic diseases.
You have the option of hysterectomy -removing just the uterus and cervix, and leaving the ovaries in the dog. This removes the risk of pyometra and makes your dog sterile. It also eliminate the mess of the heat cycle, though your female will still cycle and be attractive to males.
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Thanks so much for your response, Dr. Sara. I do want them to have a full spay. I have two older Tzu girls; the 11 year old had a full spay at six months and the eight year old had the partial spay at six months. This time I waited because that seems to be the prevailing opinion. They are all fed raw, have twice yearly vet visits, snap tests/blood tests, etc... Treated homeopathically and holistically and enjoy excellent health. I plan to vacation for three weeks this summer and board the girls in a home environment. I don't want to put them in the position of being away from me and possibly being bothered because they are attractive to a male who might be boarded during the same time period.
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I'm still open to persuasion. It was actually your comments during Empower Hour that shifted me to full spay. I realize that you have a Neutering class coming up but timing might be off for my decision. Personally, would you give your girls a partial or full spay and why? I understand if you need to give me the icing without the cake in your response...
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I have three Bernese Mountain Dog bitches. My two retired breeding bitches (8 and 11) have had OSS (almost 2 years ago and 6 years ago). Elderly BMD have a high incidence of pyometra, hence, I did not want to leave the uterus and cervix in, yet I wanted to give them the benefit of retaining the hormones.
I have never had a issue with stray dogs at the house, or being troubled on our walks through the neighbourhood. I do walk the girls through the neighbourhood even when they are in full fertile heat. I have shown these girls, though I do not go to shows while they are in heat. Intact male dogs have no interest in my girls (aside from usual dog curiousity) when they are not in heat, and they have been around many intact males at dog shows. No male dog has ever tried to mate with them when they are not in heat.
I belong to a BMD club, and the majority of members have removed the gonads (neutered or spayed) their animals. The majority of these dogs are overweight, and have a much lower energy level than my girls. In addition to that, cancer is the major cause of death in Berners, and the presence of gonads is correlated with a lower incidence of many cancers. I monitor my bitches for mammary tumours, the one common cancer more prevalent in bitches with ovaries.
Incontinence, cognitive dysfunction, immune diseases, certain anxiety disorders, and hypothyroidism occur at a higher rate in gonadectomized dogs.
Subjectively, many of my clients who have neutered or spayed dogs in adulthood tell me that they noticed a dulling of the personality or an increase in anxiety after the gonads are removed. This would be harder to see in a puppy, as the personality is not as formed.
All together, those are the main reason why my girls keep their hormones.
I have never had a issue with stray dogs at the house, or being troubled on our walks through the neighbourhood. I do walk the girls through the neighbourhood even when they are in full fertile heat. I have shown these girls, though I do not go to shows while they are in heat. Intact male dogs have no interest in my girls (aside from usual dog curiousity) when they are not in heat, and they have been around many intact males at dog shows. No male dog has ever tried to mate with them when they are not in heat.
I belong to a BMD club, and the majority of members have removed the gonads (neutered or spayed) their animals. The majority of these dogs are overweight, and have a much lower energy level than my girls. In addition to that, cancer is the major cause of death in Berners, and the presence of gonads is correlated with a lower incidence of many cancers. I monitor my bitches for mammary tumours, the one common cancer more prevalent in bitches with ovaries.
Incontinence, cognitive dysfunction, immune diseases, certain anxiety disorders, and hypothyroidism occur at a higher rate in gonadectomized dogs.
Subjectively, many of my clients who have neutered or spayed dogs in adulthood tell me that they noticed a dulling of the personality or an increase in anxiety after the gonads are removed. This would be harder to see in a puppy, as the personality is not as formed.
All together, those are the main reason why my girls keep their hormones.
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Wow, what a great thread! Thanks Maura and Dr. Sara for sharing.
Maura, how flexible are your vacation dates?
Have you discussed this with the person who will be watching them when you are away?
If you plan to do so, ask whether s/he would be OK with the OSS.
Dr. Lazarus does these (and vasectomies) at Rippowam in Stamford.
Dr. Jeff
Maura, how flexible are your vacation dates?
Have you discussed this with the person who will be watching them when you are away?
If you plan to do so, ask whether s/he would be OK with the OSS.
Dr. Lazarus does these (and vasectomies) at Rippowam in Stamford.
Dr. Jeff
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Thanks for you input, Dr. Jeff and Dr. Sara. I have been unable to find any studies in toy dogs. Beautiful, big Bermese are at the other end of the size spectrum and may be subject to a difference in prevalence and conditions. I was unaware that I needed to monitor for mammary tumors. Still lots to consider and I need to acquire more knowledge before making a final decision. Appreciate your sharing and addressing my query in this forum.
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Interesting.
That explains why they didn't mention the option when I took Vanya there to be spayed.
I guess they just don't know since according to Dr. Lazarus himself, he does.
Or, perhaps he mis-understood my question...
That explains why they didn't mention the option when I took Vanya there to be spayed.
I guess they just don't know since according to Dr. Lazarus himself, he does.
Or, perhaps he mis-understood my question...
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The practice admin asked another vet because Dr. Lazarus was not in the office. She was told 'No', partial spays have never been performed at Rippowam. On the Parsemus Foundation site, he is listed only as doing vasectomy. Maybe Dr. Lazarus did partial spays while training in South Africa.
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Hi Liz,
My girls are scheduled for a standard spay on Friday. My eight year old had the partial spay done at Tufts by the head of the department almost eight years ago. I actually see no difference between my 11 year old (full spay) and 8 year old (partial spay). I had no idea that the partial spay girl should be monitored for mammary tumors and that she continues a cycle and may be bothered by males during this time. My girls are both perfect weight and have not experienced the problems that Dr. Sara details. For that I am grateful. Virtually no research available on toy dogs which is the category Shih Tzu fall into and although Dr. Lazarus claims to do partial spay - and I do not question his ability - I am exceedingly uncomfortable with the fact that his associate and staff were unaware that he provides this surgery given that it is a much more precise procedure and calls for special expertise. I'm sure that everything will go fine for Penny. Best wishes.
My girls are scheduled for a standard spay on Friday. My eight year old had the partial spay done at Tufts by the head of the department almost eight years ago. I actually see no difference between my 11 year old (full spay) and 8 year old (partial spay). I had no idea that the partial spay girl should be monitored for mammary tumors and that she continues a cycle and may be bothered by males during this time. My girls are both perfect weight and have not experienced the problems that Dr. Sara details. For that I am grateful. Virtually no research available on toy dogs which is the category Shih Tzu fall into and although Dr. Lazarus claims to do partial spay - and I do not question his ability - I am exceedingly uncomfortable with the fact that his associate and staff were unaware that he provides this surgery given that it is a much more precise procedure and calls for special expertise. I'm sure that everything will go fine for Penny. Best wishes.
Hi Maura, thanks for the insight. I've been going to Rippowam for over 25 years, but I understand your reservations. I still don't know what way I will go. Yes, they always bring up those mammary tumors but I can't help but think our dogs are not as vulnerable thanks to Dr. Feinman and Dr. Chambreau and everyone at Holistic Actions. By the way I met your girls at Dr. Feinman's a few years ago. They are adorable! Good luck on Friday! Liz
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Hi Liz, thanks for asking. Dr. Robb was awesome from start to finish! Girls were; spayed, had hernias repaired, dentals and microchipped. Joy (7 lb) had a much smaller hernia. Two small incisions and virtually good to go. Hasn't slowed her down a bit. Jele Bean (8 lb) had a much bigger hernia and one long incision. Dosed her with Arnica yesterday and at 1:00 am when she still couldn't settle down, I gave her a Zylkene in her ground raw meat and she slept for six hours. We've had a quiet day today and at different times, I've cuddled them on my lap for two hour stints. They are eating/dirnking/pooping and moving around the house without a problem. Gave Jele Bean another dose of Arnica early this afternoon. It's all good. Am very happy with my decision and wish you the same. Best ~
Oh, thank you for letting me know! I'm so glad they did well! I did meet your girls! I recognize Jele Bean's name. You had one in each arm. I probably over estimated the timing. Time is getting away from me. They are adorable! Is Dr. Robb your conventional vet? He sounds like a good one. Liz
